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Re: FURLOUGHS Kris Wolff 14 May 2009 12:42 EST

I have come across some sponsored programs people who must be the type this
PI has encountered, and they frustrate me as well.  These are the people who
say things like, "This guy is so stupid, how did he get his PhD when he
can't even follow simple directions?"  I always want to counter with, "And
how is your gene-splicing going?"  They act as though their job would be
great if not for the pesky professors that keep bothering them, without even
a thought to the fact that it's the professors' research activities that are
providing them with their jobs.  I find that kind of attitude extremely
ignorant.

However, those are probably also the people who don't care enough about
their job knowledge to sign up for an informative listserve like this one.

-----Original Message-----
From: Research Administration List [mailto:xxxxxx@hrinet.org] On Behalf Of
Matthew Katz
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 1:23 PM
To: xxxxxx@hrinet.org
Subject: Re: [RESADM-L] FURLOUGHS

Thanks Paula and everyone else that responded to my response.  Obviously
this is a very sore topic for all of us that do work so hard and long to aid
our faculty in the pursuit of their research endeavors and to enhance our
institutions.  Just remember for every one of these disgruntled faculty (and
we all have at least one :) ) there are so many more that are appreciative
and supportive.  Knowing that helps keep us doing what we do.
Matt

Matthew D. Katz, MHA
Assistant Vice President,
Sponsored Research and Contract Management
Western University of Health Sciences
309 E. 2nd Street
Pomona, CA  91766
(909) 469-5567
(909) 469-5569 FAX

-----Original Message-----
From: Research Administration List [mailto:xxxxxx@hrinet.org] On Behalf Of
Mccauley, Paula M
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 6:55 AM
To: xxxxxx@hrinet.org
Subject: Re: [RESADM-L] FURLOUGHS

Thank you, Matthew. That was put very nicely. It can be so frustrating (and
sometimes even demoralizing) when we are vilified by researchers. We strive
so hard to facilitate research by allowing our faculty to focus on the
science while we worry about regulations and policy. It's not a glamorous
job, but I think most of us take extreme pride in the part we play in
important scientific endeavors.

Paula McCauley-Shelton, B.A.

Grants Manager

UAMS Department of Pediatrics

Grants Administration MS 512-1

501-364-2368 Phone

501-364-4656 Fax

xxxxxx@uams.edu

*NEW*  We've Moved! The Pediatric Grants Administration group is now located
on the 3rd floor of the ACHRI Building.

-----Original Message-----
From: Research Administration List [mailto:xxxxxx@hrinet.org] On Behalf Of
Matthew Katz
Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2009 10:59 PM
To: xxxxxx@hrinet.org
Subject: Re: [RESADM-L] FURLOUGHS

Alex,
sorry to contradict you and it sounds like you've had some very difficult
dealings with sponsored program offices in the past, but awards are not made
to individuals.  This is made very clear in every Program Announcement and
RFA as well as all federal regulations.  In fact, if you read the RFA's you
have to belong to an institution in order to even apply for a grant award.
And awards can only be moved to another institution if the receiving
institution allows the transfer.
Obviously both faculty and institutions need each other for grants.  It is
the faculty with their intellect and know how and scientific ideas that
generates the awards and it is the institutions that foster that scientific
creativity and provide space and necessary services for these research
projects to be carried out.  Sponsored Program offices serve as the liaison
between the institution, the PI and the sponsors to ensure that everyone
keeps to the task at hand.  We ensure that sponsor guidelines and
regulations are met, that the PI's have access to the resources to do their
work and aid in any difficulties they may encounter and to represent the
institution in all situations.
It is not unusual for faculty to feel that the Sponsored program office is
more of a hinderance then help but in reality without the sponsored program
office, faculty would be forced to decipher regulations on their own and
take valuable time away from their scientific endeavors.  The sponsored
programs office allows faculty to focus on the science and if you work with
the adminstrators instead of against them, you'd find that things would
actually work faster and more effectively. That's how we try to work at my
institution.
Matthew

________________________________

From: Research Administration List on behalf of l alex
Sent: Wed 5/13/2009 8:00 PM
To: xxxxxx@hrinet.org
Subject: Re: [RESADM-L] FURLOUGHS

NO...you're WRONG. The awards are to the INDIVIDUAL - that's why they can be
moved to other institutions. (not to make ad hominen comments, but unless
one has ever written/been awarded several R01s/PPGs, SPA people have NO idea
the mental toll this takes on an individual).

It' the SPA people who have said outright to me that if it weren't for SPA,
the PIs would "steal" the $ for "shag carpet"! Yes, these extremely hard
won, intellectually gifted PIs once they are lucky enough to even receive an
award, this of course is the 1st thing on their list! I take exception to
this systemic attitude that the PIs work for SPA and the the zeal put forth
by SPA to increase the IDC rates. There is only so much sponsor/NIH pie, and
I frankly would rather it be spent on SCIENCE not administrators whose idea
of help in grant submissions is to forward NIH website addresses or send
reams of boiler plate text. What is SPA being paid for (by the PIs IDCs) if
not to provide assistance/guidance when it is needed.
This is why there is resentment towards SPA - the hubris that it IS their $.
If not for the unique ideas and hard fought effort to get a grant (currently
at the 15%-tile at certain institutes at NIH), there would be NO IDCs, SPA,
etc. These PIs who often work 80+ hours/week, while the SPA people often are
MIA, conveniently just prior to grant deadline, off for "training" or
conventions.
Obviously this is a sore point due to excessive hours prepping a grant for
which the SPA person, left the office at 2PM. So what if it doesn't get
submitted in time; it'll only mean a loss of some $5 million in IDCs, much
less than the actually the DC, which SPA doesn't care about.

SO...please do furlough, to get back to the topic, but at least please do it
to state line/admin people, who seem to be in abundance in most
institutions, often with grandiose titles, e.g. Coordinator of Excellence &
Efficiency Director!

May 13, 2009 10:09:21 PM, xxxxxx@hrinet.org wrote:

===========================================

Make your point. It sounds like you are saying the institutions are
"stealing"
the PIs F&A. The grants are given to the institutions. The awards belong to
the
institutions. The indirect costs belong to the institutions, not the highly
funded, tenured PIs. Most gifts are given to institutions, too. Normally
they
are restricted and bear little F&A. Depending upon the
sponsor/terms/instution/policy, these funds can be portable if the PI
leaves.
The PI, SPAs and anyone who manages these accounts should be responsible.
Also,
under certain conditions,  severance and unemployment CAN be charged to DHHS
grants.

________________________________

From: Research Administration List on behalf of l alexander
Sent: Wed 5/13/2009 8:54 PM
To: xxxxxx@hrinet.org
Subject: Re: [RESADM-L] FURLOUGHS

I can't wait for the lawsuits to begin from highly funded, tenured faculty
who
provide the institutions with a rich source of IDCs, which the SPAs are all
to
happy to take their cut FIRST. Can't wait to have the NIH audit these
instituions.

May 13, 2009 11:39:22 AM, xxxxxx@hrinet.org wrote:

===========================================

We have implemented furlough days and applied them to all employees,
regardless
of funding source, no exceptions.  Our employees are employed by the state
and
furlough days apply to all state employees, even if their salary is grant
funded.

Sara

Sara L. Wilhelm
Grant Accountant
General Accounting
Hitchins Room 109
Frostburg State University
Phone: 301-687-7054
Fax: 301-687-4494
xxxxxx@frostburg.edu

________________________________

From: Research Administration List on behalf of Wilma Ennenga
Sent: Wed 5/13/2009 11:29 AM
To: xxxxxx@hrinet.org
Subject: [RESADM-L] FURLOUGHS

Good morning! It's a beautiful 75 F degrees in Flagstaff, glorious blue
skies,
fragrant pine trees, trails calling and yet here I am at work. So it had
better
be for something fun like the "Furlough Issue" as it has come to be known in
some locales. Still, I'd rather be outside so I'd appreciate your soonest
response to these questions!

The questions:

*         Is your university (1) considering and/or (2) implementing
FURLOUGHS?

*         If so, will the furlough program apply to all employees regardless
of
funding source?

*         Alternatively, are you making an exception for "non-state" funding
and
exempting those employees?

If everybody replies directly to me - xxxxxx@nau.edu - rather than
to
the listserve, I promise to post a summary of responses by COB today.

Thanks,

Winnie

Wilma G. (Winnie) Ennenga

Director, Office of Grant and Contract Services

Northern Arizona University

Applied Research and Development Bldg. #56, Suite 240

1298 South Knoles Drive

Flagstaff, AZ 86011-4130

Telephone: 928/523-8319

Fax: 928/523-1075

P Please consider the environment before printing this email

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 Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including
 subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available
 via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists")
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======================================================================
 Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including
 subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available
 via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists")
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 Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including
 subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available
 via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists")
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