Re: CRA - Fact or Urban Legend Debbie Smith 05 Dec 2005 18:08 EST
I was not aware that one could actually obtain CRA certification without taking the exam, regardless of experience. When it first started, some of us were asked to submit potential questions; and it is my recollection that we "waived" our rights to sit for the exam by doing so. Of course, it's been a long time, and my recollection may not match the facts! Debbie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Folk, Lee" <xxxxxx@UHCL.EDU> To: <xxxxxx@HRINET.ORG> Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 3:21 PM Subject: Re: [RESADM-L] CRA - Fact or Urban Legend > Yes, it's true. About 2 years ago, I worked with an administrator who > said > that she was "one of the originals" who did not have to take the test. > Apparently, she helped get it started. Not sure if she has since retired. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Research Administration List [mailto:xxxxxx@HRINET.ORG] On Behalf > Of > Jennifer Shambrook > Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 3:11 PM > To: xxxxxx@HRINET.ORG > Subject: Re: [RESADM-L] CRA - Fact or Urban Legend > > > As opposed to the CPA which in my state requires college transcripts > showing > at least 120 semester hours of awarded college credit and a certain number > of those hours being in accounting for initial testing. > > I still think the CRA is a good thing... > > I'm also still waiting for an answer to the question of whether there are > folks out there TODAY that have a CRA that never sat for the exam. > > Where's Chuck? > >>>> xxxxxx@CENTRAL.UH.EDU 12/05/05 04:02PM >>> > I also took the exam. In order to sit for the exam without having a > bachelor's degree, you must have additional years of experience. > > Here are the qualifications to sit for the exam, from the Research > Administrators Certification Council website: > > Qualifications/Credentials: > > 1. Experience. > Candidates applying to sit for the Certified Research Administrator's > Examination must possess a Bachelor's degree and three (3) years of > substantial involvement in research or sponsored programs administration > > either in a sponsoring or recipient organization or the equivalent in a > self-funded organization. > > Exceptions MAY be granted upon petition and meeting the > minimum experience and education requirements of an Associate's Degree and > six (6) years of experience OR eight (8) years of substantial experience > in > the sponsored programs/research administration field. > > Regards, > Deborah > > Deborah Anne Brougher, CRA > College Research Administrator > College of Pharmacy > Science & Research Bldg 2 > Room 453A > 4800 Calhoun > Houston, TX 77204-5037 > Phone 713/743-1418 > Fax 713/743-1232 > e-mail address xxxxxx@uh.edu > -----Original Message----- > From: Jennifer Shambrook [mailto:xxxxxx@MUSC.EDU] > Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 2:37 PM > To: xxxxxx@HRINET.ORG > Subject: Re: [RESADM-L] CRA - Fact or Urban Legend > > I would be interested in hearing answers to Dr. Miller's other questions > and > comments concerning the credential. > > I've recommended to people that don't have bachelor's degrees, and no > plans > to obtain them, to get the CRA as a sign that they can set and achieve a > professional development goal in lieu of a degree. > > In my own hiring practices, I would count a CRA and 5 years experience as > almost equivalent to a Bachelors Degree when comparing candidates. I work > in an academic environment, though, and a certification that does not > require a degree will always be looked askance upon by the academic > investigators we serve. > > Personally, I am generally supportive of CRAs as long as the person took > the > exam to get it. It's my understanding that in the beginning, one could > obtain a CRA based upon longevity in the profession, and renew from > attending sessions at SRA or NCURA without taking an exam. Can anyone > tell > me if this fact or urban legend? > > If it is fact: Has everyone that holds the CRA designation today taken > the > exam? > > I have an inquiring mind and would like to know. > > -Jennifer > > > > Jennifer Morgan Shambrook, MHA > > Associate Chair for Research Administration > Co-Director Division of Public Psychiatry > Department of Psychiatry and Behavioral Science > Medical University of South Carolina > 67 President Street, Suite 504 > Charleston, South Carolina 29425 > > voice: 843-792-0191 > fax: 843-792-0048 > email: xxxxxx@musc.edu > > >>>> xxxxxx@UAF.EDU 12/05/05 02:17PM >>> > Hi Pam, the same goes for our announcement I recently posted. The > reasons we put it as a requirement are for the same reasons Bill listed, > > and I think they are very good ones. > > Thanks, > Andrew > > Bill Schulze wrote: > >> Hi, Pam: >> >> I have a feeling you are referring to our announcement, although I >> believe others do that as well... >> >> You make some good philosophical points, however our motive is more >> practical than philosophical. Including a certification requirement in > >> the job description for Senior Research Administrator has allowed us >> to obtain HR approval of a professional position at a competitive >> salary level. >> >> We do not use the CRA as a screening instrument, or we would require >> it up front. I feel many will agree that the CRA is an important >> credential for various reasons, but by no means do I feel it should be > >> considered the quintessential measure of knowledge or competency >> within the profession. >> >> We expect our Senior Research Administrators to be experienced and >> highly skilled research administrators. Our evaluations of candidates >> during the interview process are based on their knowledge of the field > >> and demonstrated skills, and since the 4 professionals currently in >> our office have over 60 years of combined experience in Research >> Administration, we have little trouble with these assessments. >> >> Bill >> >> PS: If anyone is interested in a good job with great people, please >> apply... We're looking for really good research administrators, and if > >> you don't already have the CRA, don't worry about it - we'll give you >> 3 years and also pay for it... >> >> **************************************** >> William E. Schulze, EdD >> Director of Sponsored Programs >> University of Nevada, Las Vegas >> Phone (702) 895-1357 >> Fax (702) 895-0986 >> xxxxxx@ccmail.nevada.edu >> **************************************** >> >> Inactive hide details for Pamela Miller <xxxxxx@USFCA.EDU>Pamela >> Miller <xxxxxx@USFCA.EDU> >> >> >> >> >> >> *Pamela Miller <xxxxxx@USFCA.EDU>* >> Sent by: Research Administration List >> <xxxxxx@HRINET.ORG> >> >> 12/05/2005 09:35 AM >> Please respond to Research Administration >> Discussion List >> >> >> >> To: xxxxxx@HRINET.ORG >> cc: >> Subject: [RESADM-L] CRA as a screening instrument >> >> >> >> >> This is something that has been bothering me, and I have decided to >> share my concerns via this forum: I recently noticed a research >> administration position announcement that required that persons >> applying for the job have CRA status or be willing to obtain this >> designation within a few years of employment. In my opinion, requiring > >> research administrators obtain a Certified Research Administrator >> (CRA) designation to obtain and maintain employment is very premature. >> >> The exam for the CRA tests an examinee's knowledge of particular body >> of knowledge and indicates that a high enough score on the test along >> with a certain number of years on the job and a bachelor's degree is >> sufficient for the individual to be "certified" as a research or >> grants administrator. The unasked questions in this transaction are: >> Who decides what the fundamental body of knowledge is in research >> administration? The exam may indeed have captured the incredible >> diversity of this ever changing field, but how do we know? Is there an > >> objective credentialing body behind the CRA exam, such as the >> Committee on Accreditation (CoA) which oversees the accreditation of >> programs and exams in professional psychology for the American >> Psychological Association (APA)? Is there anything more rigorous than >> anecdotal evidence to support the validity of the exam? >> >> Assuming the CRA exam does capture all the fundamentals of research >> administration, are the questions good questions, i.e., do the >> questions really tap the individual's true understanding of this body >> of knowledge? No test is perfect, and there are numerous factors that >> affect the reliability of a test, e.g., the length of the test, the >> way the items are constructed, and even the directions for taking the >> test. Reliability is an essential characteristic of a good test, >> because if a test doesn't measure consistently (reliably), then one >> can not know if the scores resulting from a particular administration >> are due to the examinee's achievement or random error. The CRA web >> site does not report test validity or reliability information, and >> these are important things to know before making someone's job >> dependent upon having or getting a CRA! >> >> Research administrators work hard, often without anyone noticing or >> appreciating the work being done. It therefore is very tempting to try > >> and place research administration at the same table with other valued >> professions. However, if one looks at what other professions have done > >> and are doing to achieve this respected status, it is clear that we in > >> research administration have a long way to go. The CRA may be an >> important first step, but in my opinion it is unwise to think that we >> have reached the end of the journey. >> >> Pamela F. Miller, Ph.D. >> Director, Office of Sponsored Projects >> The University of San Francisco >> 2130 Fulton Street >> San Francisco, CA 94117-1080 >> TEL 415-422-5368 >> FAX 415-422-6222 >> EMAIL xxxxxx@usfca.edu_ <mailto:xxxxxx@usfca.edu> >> >> ====================================================================== > >> Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including >> subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available >> via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists") >> ====================================================================== >> > > > ====================================================================== > Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including > subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available > via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists") > ====================================================================== > > > ====================================================================== > Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including > subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available > via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists") > ====================================================================== > > > ====================================================================== > Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including > subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available > via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists") > ====================================================================== > > > ====================================================================== > Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including > subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available > via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists") > ====================================================================== > > > ====================================================================== > Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including > subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available > via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists") > ====================================================================== > ====================================================================== Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists") ======================================================================