Whoa, Charlie...guess I need to clarify. NOT suggesting we 'outlaw' using "Statistician" or "Data Analyst" to describe roles in research projects. These descriptions can be immensely helpful in the narrative and budget but are way too specific for what I was seeking. I'm going for overall big-picture roles whether stated within proposal or not...so that everyone is clear on who can spend and who can't more or less. I was looking for a list (if there is one) that provided general descriptions of possible roles...and the list would be something like this: PI - directs project, responsible for overall outcome, main fiscal responsibility, from our institution only Co-PI - specific duties on project, may have fiscal responsibility if allowed by PI re: record-keeping, and may have some spending ability, from our institution only Senior/Other Personnel - duties on project, no fiscal responsibility and cannot spend without permisison of PI (or Co-PI when allowed), can be from other institutions or organizations/industry Grad student - directed by others on project, some duties, no spending ability, from our institution only Collaborator: develops and spends own budget, works with PI to determine duties in joint effort, receives own award, can be from other institutions or organizations/industry Subcontract/Subawardeee: develops statement of work with PI, creates own budget but is paid by PI institution for work - is part of PI's award - can spend only amount provided by PI from sponsor, can be from other institutions or organizations/industry etc. These descriptions are just off the top of my head and certainly unofficial, but I hope it clarifies things. The Statistician or Data Analyst would fall in the Senior/Other Personnel category most likely...which could tell everyone he/she has no spending ability on this project .. and again SHOULD be listed as Statistician, etc on proposal. Does that make more sense? This stems from a PI request to include someone from another institution on a proposal, but this 'someone' didn't want to have to run it through his institution. The question was...if he's not a subaward, what role can he play to achieve that? This original question got us thinking then about the new initiative to list multiple PI's and what that will do to monitoring expenditures on the projects. Thanks to all for previous responses...and I welcome more in this discussion. Terri -- Terri Hall Associate Director of Sponsored Programs (eRA) Office of Research*University of Notre Dame Phn: (574) 631-7378*Fax: (574) 631-6630 511 Main Building*Notre Dame, IN*46556 Quoting xxxxxx@aecom.yu.edu: > You know, I come from the research side of the mountain where it is felt that > competitiveness in seeking extramural funding should be the goal of research > administration. It is also generally conceded that there are "rules" that you > have to obey so someone doesn't go to jail. > > But if some "data dictionary" is going to tell me that on my proposal I can't > label Dr. X as a "Statistician" or "Data Analyst" or "Translator" (which are > certainly much more useful and descriptive of roles than are "Grad Student" > or "Other" ??!!), then I am going to burn that data dictionary. Cmon, are > you > really going to sacrifice clarity for strict adherence to some list of > titles? > > CH > > Quoting Joseph Bass <xxxxxx@jsb-consulting.com>: > > > These are the project roles that were in the original data dictionary > > Consultant > > Co-PD/PI > > Graduate Student > > Key Person > > Other > > Other Professional > > PD/PI > > Post Doctoral > > Post Doctoral Associate > > Technician > > Undergraduate Student > > > > I have attached a old Key Person page > > > > > > Joe Bass > > JSB Consulting, LLC > > Managing Member > > xxxxxx@JSB-Consulting.com > > > > Phone: 301-774-4229 Mobile: 240-305-8056 Fax: 240-220-0654 > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: xxxxxx@aecom.yu.edu [mailto:xxxxxx@aecom.yu.edu] > > Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 6:15 PM > > To: xxxxxx@jsb-consulting.com > > Subject: Re: [RESADM-L] Roles on research projects > > > > I'd be interested. I just can't imagine tho. To have some bureaucrat > > question whether a technician is doing technician stuff rather than > > investigator or > > administrative4 assistant stuff seems ridiculous. And...my comments were > > based on memories of people creating very unconventional sounding roles on > > NIH proposals, mostly in social sciences. But i might be wrong. > > > > charlie > > > > Quoting xxxxxx@jsb-consulting.com: > > > > > I think roles and definitions exist. Maybe not in Grants.Gov but the > > > standard has them. I can send it to you if you want > > > > > > Joe Bass > > > xxxxxx@jsb-consulting.com > > > > > > --- Original Message --- > > > From: Charlie Hathaway <xxxxxx@AECOM.YU.EDU> > > > Sent: Fri 8/26/2005 3:27 pm > > > To: xxxxxx@HRINET.ORG > > > Subject: Re: [RESADM-L] Roles on research projects > > > > > > I don't think there is a list of acceptable roles. Other than PI, I > > > doubt the feds would attempt definitions. Definitions would limit the > > > ability of researchers to do what they think needs to be done. Who's > > > to say there could > > > > > > never be a "Snake Charmer" or "Massage Therapist" on a grant? > > > > > > As for Co-PIs (a meaningless term at present)...I'll bet the new > > > policy uses > > > > > > equal lead investigators at different institutions as a proto-typical > > > example > > > > > > of why true Co-PIs are needed. > > > > > > CH > > > > > > > > > Quoting Terri Hall <xxxxxx@ND.EDU>: > > > > > > > We have had several discussions about the various roles on research > > > projects, > > > > their definitions, and their responsibilities or spending privileges > > > > on > > > the > > > > projects. > > > > > > > > Does anyone know if these roles have been defined by the federal > > > government > > > > for federal projects? Or is this up to the discretion of the sponsor > > > > or university as to who can serve as what, and the duties/privileges > > > > each > > > role > > > > will have? > > > > > > > > For example...if one of our investigators wants to include an > > > > investigator from another institution on a proposal...that investigator > > can serve as a: > > > > 1. subcontractor/subawardee > > > > 2. collaborator > > > > 3. consultant > > > > 4. senior personnel/key personnel/other significant contributor 5. ? > > > > other options? > > > > > > > > Secondly, we do not currently allow those from other institutions to > > > > serve > > > as > > > > co-PIs on our projects unless it is a sponsor requirement. But now > > > > there's talk of multiple-PI's on projects...yikes! > > > > > > > > Anyone know of a complete list of research personnel allowed on > > > > federal projects? with definitions of roles and who has spending > > authority or not? > > > > > > > > I couldn't find anything in the RESADM-L archives...or NCURA...or > > > > SRA regarding this. > > > > Some university websites provide definitions..but none references a > > > federal > > > > source. > > > > Are there any? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Terri > > > > > > > > > > > > Terri M. Hall > > > > Associate Director of Sponsored Programs (eRA) Office of Research * > > > > University of Notre Dame > > > > 511 Main Building * Notre Dame, Indiana 46556 > > > > Phn: (574) 631-7378 Fax: (574) 631-6630 > > > > http://www.nd.edu/~research/ ~ an FDP institution ~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==================================================================== > > > > == Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including > > > > subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available > > > > via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv > > > > Lists") > > > > ==================================================================== > > > > == > > > > > > > > > > > > > ====================================================================== > > > Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including > > > subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available > > > via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists") > > > ====================================================================== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ====================================================================== Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists") ======================================================================
