Ditto

At 01:48 PM 6/30/2004, you wrote:
>Chuck,
>
>I may have told you this before, but it's worth saying again.  The
>profession of research administration owes you its genuine appreciation and
>gratitude.  You have quietly and continually served us all by the thoughtful
>and coherent answers you provide on the listserv.
>
>I don't read all the exchanges on the listserv, but I always read your
>responses.  The delete button is not for a Chermside email, because I know I
>will learn something, or confirm what I think I know, by looking at your
>message.  You take the time, which must be considerable, to write a response
>that is cogent, applicable to the question, and that takes into account the
>need for a context in understanding an answer.
>
>I don't know that we have a way to appropriately honor the extent of your
>teaching prowess through the use of this volunteer medium, but I wanted you
>to know that your efforts are sincerely appreciated -- even by those of us
>who should know as much as you do.
>
>The rumor through the grapevine is that you are contemplating retirement.  I
>hope that's only a rumor.  Your expertise and nuturance would be sorely
>missed.
>
>Kim
>
>Kim Moreland, Director
>Grant and Contract Administration
>Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center
>1100 Fairview Avenue, N
>M/S J6-500
>Seattle, Washington  98109
>xxxxxx@fhcrc.org
>206/667-4868 (voice)
>206/667-6221 (fax)
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Herbert B. Chermside [mailto:xxxxxx@VCU.EDU]
>Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2004 6:26 AM
>To: xxxxxx@HRINET.ORG
>Subject: Re: [RESADM-L] Can stipends be charged to R01 grants??
>
>
>You have the correct principles in your procedure.  Your internal mechanism
>has to be tailored to the needs of your other HR and payroll systems.  Note
>that payment of a traineeship or fellowship should result in a 1099
>(without withholding unless the payee requests it) for tax purposes, while
>an employee receives a W-2 (the difference between "income" and "wage
>income" under tax regulations).
>
>A confusion is the careless way individuals speak of "fellow", "post-doc",
>etc.  Be sure that your internal documentation and business practices
>explicitly differentiate.  For federal funds, the program announcement and
>the award make the differentiation clear.  Explicitly, NIH research grants
>(R-xx) do not support fellowships/traineeships), while other grants (e.g.,
>K-XX and T-xx)  support fellowships/traineeships.  For other external
>funds, you may have to probe a little to determine the difference.  For
>internal funds, you must be sure that the differentiation is quite
>explicit.  Note that fewer and fewer institutions have internal funds for
>fellowships/traineeships.
>
>Yes, there is also confusion from the fact that fellows/trainees and
>employees (at the same levels)  appear to perform very similar
>activities.  That is because, at these levels, acquisition of knowledge and
>skills for fellows/trainees is gained by performing the activities
>(generally research) that an employee does.  One differentiation can be how
>"success" is evaluated: did the fellow/trainee "learn" through performance;
>did the employee succeed in performance?  Another is the standard for
>tenure in the position: was the fellow/trainee successfully meet the the
>training goal (like a scholarship requires continued meeting of a grade
>point average, for example); does the employee do the required work in a
>satisfactory manner?  What they did day-to-day may be similar, and success
>may look the same, but the underlying question was different.
>
>Making these differences clear in your documentation of procedures may help
>your legal staff understand.  And making transition from one category to
>another, and back, simple to accomplish will help; leaving any
>administrative process difficult encourages ignoring correct process, which
>can lead to major non-compliances.  There are related concerns for these
>two categories in the benefits area.  Health benefits -- level and who/how
>pays -- is most important to these individuals, which is why most
>fellowship/traineeship awards allow health insurance as a specific direct
>cost while for employees it is buried in the benefits package.  The
>institution is responsible for FICA/medicare withholding and employer
>payment for employees, but not for fellow/trainees.  DO make the transition
>easy because often individuals move from one category to another, and can
>be in either or both during a tax period.  And if possible, for perceived
>equity, make the total compensation (income and health benefits) as similar
>as possible between individuals who are at equal levels but in different
>categories.
>
>Chuck
>
>
>At 07:10 PM 6/29/2004, you wrote:
>
>>All,
>>
>>At the past week's NIH regional conference, I heard NIH tell us that any
>>trainee (postdoc or grad student) who receives a stipend instead of a
>>salary should NOT be charged to NIH R01 grants.  Before we discontinue
>>this practice at our institute, I thought I'd check with each of you to
>>see what is actually done in practice.
>>
>>We do what I suspect many of you do:  treat postdocs on a fellowship as
>>"non-employees receiving stipends" while treating postdocs paid from
>>institutional funds as "employees receiving a salary."  This ensures that
>>the former can be paid from fellowship awards (most of which prohibit an
>>employee-employer relationship) while the latter can be paid from R01
>>awards (which REQUIRE an employer/employee relationship, according to my
>>interpretation of A-122 Paragraph 7a and 53, each of which use the word
>>"employee").  Even though this drives our legal staff crazy, knowing that
>>two groups of people who are doing the exact same thing (training) are
>>treated differently from an employment perspective, we've persevered
>>anyhow, under the assumption that is how many other
>>universities/institutes do this.
>>
>>Do any of you have a different take?  Or treat your trainees differently
>>from us?
>>
>>As always, thanks in advance for your responses.
>>
>>Pat Kaufman
>>Director of Finance
>>Stowers Institute for Medical Research
>>Kansas City, MO
>>816-926-4027    xxxxxx@stowers-institute.org
>>
>>======================================================================
>>Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including
>>subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available via
>>our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists")
>>======================================================================
>
>Herbert B. Chermside, CRA
>Special Asst. to VP-Research
>Virginia Commonwealth University
>PO BOX 980568
>Richmond, VA  23298-0568
>Voice:  804-827-6036
>Fax     804-828-2051
>e-mail xxxxxx@vcu.edu
>
>
>======================================================================
> Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including
> subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available
> via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists")
>======================================================================
>
>
>======================================================================
> Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including
> subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available
> via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists")
>======================================================================

======================================================================
 Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including
 subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available
 via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists")
======================================================================