Hello, all, Let me be an "ivory tower idealist" and enter the fray here. First, a graduate degree should not be "teaching job skills." Postgraduate degrees provide insight into underlying theory and cause and effect; they promote critical and analytical thinking. I have a doctorate in higher education administration. It taught me nothing about how to negotiate a contract, fill out sponsor forms, or read guidelines. It did introduce me into the various sociological theories of organizations, efficiency, satisfaction, etc. I also learned something about the law and how it affects higher education. Job skills are specifically related to the duties and responsibilities of the position in a particular place. Learning to work with others, to work under pressure, to meet deadlines, etc. are skills (let me emphasize the skill part) that we learn as part of living. If we can't do that, we fail no matter what the degree. Any intelligent individual can learn the requisite skills on the job. Additionally, policies, guidelines and regulations (other than federal ones) are likely going to be different at each institution, to say nothing of inistitutional culture and history. So, knowing how things tick at General University is not going to get someone very far at Particular University. At the same time, I understand the divide between faculty and administration and fully recognize that faculty see certain facets of administration as a burden imposed on them from above by some power-hungry bureaucrat. Administrators too often see faculty as inconsiderate and thoughtless egomaniacs. Faculty are going to be much more accommodating and understanding of administrative red tape if the head person has a postgraduate degree, because that might be viewed as contributing to an understanding of the pressures and responsibilities associated with their students and their disciplines. Someone who is not familiar with the pressure of teaching and mentoring students while simultaneously conducting research and scholarship and serving on departmental and university committees (service) very likely does not have a complete appreciation of what faculty do with their waking hours. Grants administrators need to have that rapport with the faculty they serve (and serve is the operative word here). My statements are gross generalities only and do not apply to all. However, having been a graduate student recently; having worked in a grants office, in an office funded from a federal grant AND a lab; having friends and family who are research faculty, I am in a unique position to see, hear and hopefully understand the attitudes, personalities, and responsibilities that go into the mix in higher education. So, the bottom line is, you set out stringent job requirements but allow flexibility so that you get the person who has the knowledge, intelligence, skills, personality and cultural background that will best fit YOUR office at YOUR institution. Does a degree matter? probably not, but it helps. Does supervisory experience help? perhaps, but more important is a person's philosophy of supervision. Does familiarity with A-21 help? probably, but can't anyone with intelligence learn what it says? enough, Elsa Nadler >>> xxxxxx@UILLINOIS.EDU 04/09/03 10:00AM >>> As a Human Resources professional who has earned a Masters in Medieval Literature, I find I may be uniquely qualified to comment on this issue. While my academic side says that the post-bachelor degree probably means a certain familiarity with the world of academia and its quirks, my HR side says that position qualifications ideally should be tied to the actual work the incumbant will be doing. So the question I think we should ask is, "What job skills does an individual gain through graduate study that cannot be gained elsewhere?" ~~Maureen Maureen D. Kofkee, MA, PHR Resource and Policy Analyst University of Illinois Office of Human Resources 807 South Wright Street Champaign, IL, 61820 217.333.2590 217.333.2789 (fax) -----Original Message----- From: Mike McCallister [mailto:xxxxxx@UALR.EDU] Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2003 4:32 PM To: xxxxxx@HRINET.ORG Subject: Re: [RESADM-L] qualifications for research admin Oh please, go ahead and acknowledge Higher Ed conceit. if I hadn't finished my Ph.D., I'd have never had a shot at my true 3P (Peter Principle Potential). More and more, I think his is driven not by researchers but by OUR bosses who want a spiffy stable. Finally, someone who has earned an advanced degree has at least a bit more familiarity with the culture in which we toil. Crazy enough to get that degree, crazy enough to work here-- that sort of thing. THEN they find out we've got the best jobs on campus. Spanky >\I disagree. Aren't most faculty members interested in good service >above all else? I think most people, even in an environment that, >on the surface, seems defined by academic credentials, look at >intelligence, credibility, and work ethic above all else. What >difference does a degree make? My years spent chopping up fish and >rats didn't help me in "supervising others, assisting faculty to >develop proposals, including interpreting guidelines, setting up and >monitoring accounts & expenditures, advising on compliance issues". > >Charlie Hathaway > >PHD..piled high and deep > >At 04:21 PM 4/8/03 -0400, you wrote: >>rebecca- >>yes, the degree is absolutely necessary in an academic environment, and, even >>though the position is assistant director, i'd put the minimum at a master's. >>furthermore, i'd want to see 8-10 years experience in steadily more >>responsible >>research admin positions, with supervisory experience as well as >>experience in >>the specific areas for which this person will have responsibilties. >>susan >> >>-- >>Susan B. Burke >>Information Specialist >>Office of Research Services >>The George Washington University >>2121 I Street NW, Suite 601 >>Washington, DC 20052 >>Telephone: 202-994-9136 >>Facsimile: 202-994-9137 > >************************************** >Charles B. Hathaway, Ph.D., Director >Office of Grant Support >Albert Einstein College of Medicine >1300 Morris Park Avenue >Bronx, NY 10461-1975 >Phone: 718 430-3642 Fax: 718 430-8822 >email: xxxxxx@aecom.yu.edu >http://www.aecom.yu.edu/ogs > > >====================================================================== > Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including > subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available > via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists") >====================================================================== -- Mike McCallister, Ph. D. Director, Research and Sponsored Programs University of Arkansas at Little Rock 2801 South University Little Rock, AR 72204-1099 (v) 501-569-8474 (f) 501-371-7614 (c) 501-590-5609 Only those who risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go. - T.S. Eliot ====================================================================== Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists") ====================================================================== ====================================================================== Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists") ====================================================================== ====================================================================== Instructions on how to use the RESADM-L Mailing List, including subscription information and a web-searchable archive, are available via our web site at http://www.hrinet.org (click on "Listserv Lists") ======================================================================
